Canonizations: The case for Pacelli

An excellent piece from ‘Rorate Caeli’, broaching a question many faithful Catholics are asking themselves. While there are few who would deny the caliber of the two recent Blessed Popes, John XXIII and John Paul II, who will be canonised on Divine Mercy Sunday, it is puzzling why the failure to recognise the evident sanctity and outstanding merits of Pope Pius XII by the Congregation for the Causes of Saints appears to continue, with no foreseeable change to this situation in the immediate future. 

Pope Pius XII at prayer

Pope Pius XII at prayer

From RORATE CAELI

The canonizations of Pope John XXIII and John Paul II will take place this Sunday, with many flocking to Rome to be a part of the historic event.

Without questioning the two already-mentioned canonizations, the question still remains: Why not Pacelli?

Let it not be forgotten that his cause for beatification was expressly launched by Paul VI together with that of John XXIII precisely to combat their “almost being turned into symbols or banners of opposite tendencies within Catholicism”. In beatifying and canonizing one but not the other — does this not imply something about the relative strength of these “opposite tendencies” within the Church?

Clearly, a very strong case can be made for Eugenio Maria Giuseppe Giovanni Pacelli (Pope Pius XII), from a standpoint of sheer numbers alone. (Continue reading….)

http://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2014/04/canonizations-case-for-pacelli.html

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27 Responses to Canonizations: The case for Pacelli

  1. Roger says:

    This is the Pope who after the war was recognised as the Jews’ saviour. The Pope who occasioned the conversion of the rabbi of Rome Israel Zolli who took the name Eugenio in honour of Pope Pius XII. This the Pope who proclaimed the Dogma Of The Assumption. This the Pope who personally conscreated Russia to The Immaculate Heart in obedience to Our Lords request through the Seer of Fatima Lucy. The Pope who personally was known to be a visionary and to have seen the Dance of The Sun. Who was appointed Archbishop of Sardis in 1917 (year of Fatima) . Without doubt the Last Pope of the Tridentine mould. He upheld the rights of God over the rights of Man and for this they can’t forgive him.
    Not one of his successors has placed the Rights of God first instead they have the acclaim of the world and popularity. Pius XII the acclaim of God and the denigration of the world.
    Whose Life most resembles that of Christ?

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  2. “While there are few who would deny the caliber of the two recent Blessed Popes, John XXIII and John Paul II”

    Err, really? I know a lot of Catholics who feel very uneasy about the canonisations and even more people who do not accept them at all.

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  3. kathleen says:

    Roger, I agree that Ven. Pope Pius XII is one of the Catholic Church’s “greats” – no doubt about it whatsoever – a truly holy and exceptional Pope. One day I believe he will be recognised as such, Deo volente, but we can do nothing but submissively abide by the decisions of the Magisterium of the Church to wait for this public recognition.

    If you look into the “related” posts automatically generated by WordPress, and further links on from these posts, you will see that on this blog we have posted many articles on Pope Pius XII, extolling his enormous contribution to the Body of Christ.
    ______

    Ragazzagallese – nice to see you here again! 🙂
    May I ask you to explain a bit more what you are referring to about those who feel “uneasy” about the canonisations of the two aforementioned Popes?

    I do myself admit to hearing a lot of uneasiness whispered around on the canonisation (without a miracle) on the Pope of Vatican II (John XIII), and for, ahem, other reasons….

    Yet, apart from the Assisi debacle of Pope John Paul II’s last and failing years, surely the Marian Pope who played a key role in the collapse of Communism, who so loved Fatima and its timeless message, who brought a collapsing Church back on line, etc. etc., is worthy of being raised to the altars of sainthood?

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  4. Toadspittle says:

    Shouldn’t every dead pope get an automatic free pass?
    Otherwise, what’s the point?

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  5. Roger says:

    Yes unease is the right word. John Paul II removed the Crucifix so that it would not offend the Jews. Remember this is the Pope Christ Vicar on Earth LOVES THOU ME MORE THAN THE REST!
    John XXIII well the Moscow-Vatican Treaty was negotiated and signed during his Pontificate. After that how could the Fatima Consecration take place? Its again a question of LOVES THOU ME MORE THAN THE REST.
    There has been a watering and playing down of the Faith since 1960. Now if the Church will not put God first then the danger is of cutting themselves off from the root. The Jews did this 2000 years ago. The true history of the faith has great saints putting the Divine first!
    I am not seeing this and this lukewarm.
    Fatima spoke of WW I and fortold WW II so I do not disassociate God from the affairs of this world. remember Yalta!! Where Europe was carved up between Russia and USA! Now look at Ukraine and consider that the Yalta concord is being torn up!
    Dangerous times for NOT putting God first.
    Remember that Masonry is AUTOMATICALLY Excommunicated this doesn’t need a formal trila finding etc.. the presence of excommunicated prelates and clergy in Rome in the 60’s who were permitted to remain in their POSTS. This because of Fatima and La Sallette endangers the world.

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  6. Toadspittle says:

    “This because of Fatima and La Sallette endangers the world.”

    The world is in no danger, Roger. It will go on mindlessly spinning for a very long time yet.
    Without any people on it, perhaps – but it won’t care.
    And, by then, all the stuff you write about on here will mean nothing.

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  7. Hi Kathleen, thank you 🙂 I have been busy busy and without internet, but I’m back now!

    Regarding Pope John Paul II, I think he was a great man and yes, I think he is in heaven. Evangelium Vitae? Amazing! Theology of the Body? Amazing! Yes, great! But, should his canonisation be rushed through like this (and I do think it has been rushed)?
    I think it’s a mistake to brush off Assisi and everything that went with it. It was pretty bad. And, by bad, I mean it was horrendous.
    And lots of people don’t believe that Russia has been consecrated to Our Lady and didn’t even Sr Lucia say it? I mean, the debate is definitely wide open on that one so it can’t just be stated as fact (and I’m sure this has been debated many a time here). Why didn’t he just do it? I get on the one hand that Our Lady is not legalistic about these things, but still, why didn’t he just do it when Pius XII had already consecrated the world? Our Lady would not have specifically asked for Russia if she just wanted the world. Anyway…

    And, I know that people will say that it wasn’t his fault, he couldn’t control it etc etc but seriously, the appointments that were made during his papacy. Good grief… At least Pope Benedict got Bishop Egan and Bishop Davies in there, thank God! I know the Pope can’t change everything and make it right, but seriously…

    I don’t know, I’m not an expert. I accept the canonisation, because if I didn’t, I don’t know what my position would be anymore! I don’t have a very strong opinion on the canonisations, only that it doesn’t feel right, but I have quite a few friends who feel it’s wrong. I’m sure they could give a much more eloquent explanation, but there you go.

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  8. Roger says:

    Toad. We have the statement after the last Conclave about the serious decline of the Faith in Old Christendom. Thats called Apostacy!
    Now the Financial/Banking crisis has forced governments to change economic policies in mid stream. That crisis has created coalitions , which is another way of saying the electorate did not get a vote over the policies that were actually implemented!
    Now the war in the middle east and now Africa is far from over. The super powers are playing shadow boxing right now! USA has missiles in Poland! Russia troops on the Ukraine border. At the same time Nato including UK has military aircraft now patrolling old Eastern Block nations!
    The West is boxing Russia and China in!
    In three years we will be celebrating the 100 years of the fatima dance of the sun and the triumph Of Our Lady hasn’t happened. The real question is has Vatican II been a success ir a failure?
    The clear military might on the borders of Ukraine is a very salient reminder of Fatima!

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  9. Just read this on Rorate Caeli: http://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2014/04/editorial-note-what-pope-with-lousy.html

    Just what I needed to read! I’m going to shut up now.

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  10. Tom Fisher says:

    The three Popes in question were truly holy men. And perhaps all three should be canonised.

    But we must be careful that it never becomes the ‘norm’ or the ‘expectation’ that Popes are canonised. The Pope is the Pope, and some Popes have been saints, and some have been terribly sinful, but all have been the successor to Peter.

    May God grant us saintly Popes.

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  11. Toadspittle says:

    Razzagazzagallese makes an interesting, if oblique, point:
    “And lots of people don’t believe that Russia has been consecrated to Our Lady and didn’t even Sr Lucia say it? “
    The Virgin, we are told, occasionally visits some barely literate children to impart warnings of dire consequences if what will befall “If…or If not..”. *
    In this case if Russia is not consecrated to her.
    Surely she, at least, knows, or knew – if it has happened – or will happen, or not?
    Not only that, she also knew, or knows, in advance what the outcome of consecrating (or not) will be – or was.
    So why bother asking people to do it in the first place?
    Predestination here, I’m afraid. An argument guaranteed to get us all nowhere. (I predict.)

    “…some Popes have been saints, and some have been terribly sinful,”
    But haven’t we all been (or still are, in my case) “terribly sinful” – including some saints. Tom?
    We should consign all popes to heaven, and let God sort it out.

    * Next apparition in Shanghai?

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  12. Tom Fisher says:

    But haven’t we all been (or still are, in my case) “terribly sinful” – including some saints. Tom?

    Oh Toad, perhaps you are partly reiterating my point? And yes, many terribly sinful saints.

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  13. kathleen says:

    Hi again Ragazzagallese,

    Yes, I absolutely agree with your point (and with the views in the article on Rorate Caeli you link to) that haste in raising anyone, Popes included, to the altars of sanctity seems more than a little unwise, to say the least. It could lead to all sorts of confusion and disagreements, especially among those still alive who knew the person in life, who might not have had a totally favourable impression of them. (This was also the case with the saintly founder of Opus Dei, St. Jose Maria Escriva de Balaguer, I remember.) To open the process of canonisation a good number of years after death, in order give a better perspective on the candidate in question, has always normally been the Church’s prudent method these last 1000 years or so.

    But what are we saying here when it boils down to it? Mainly that this person did this or that wrong, so how could he/she possibly be a saint? I think we are missing something.
    Surely we all know that all saints, even the most renown and well-loved, were also sinners? That is not what canonisation is all about. A canonised saint is simply one who has been recognised by the Church for having acquired “an exceptional degree of holiness” (in spite of their mistakes and failings), and who are believed to be already in Heaven contemplating the Beatific Vision, i.e. no longer in Purgatory! From Heaven they can intercede for us, whilst their virtues and achievements on Earth give us pilgrims a Christian witness worthy of imitation.

    The vast majority of saints of course, will never be “raised to the altars” for public honour and prayers of intercession, but are an important part of the ‘Church Triumphant’, pouring down graces by their holy lives and merits on the ‘Church Militant’.

    The case of Blessed Pope JP II is an example of a holy man who “loved much”, who toiled and suffered tirelessly to fulfill his mission as Vicar of Christ to the bitter end, but who also made mistakes. The scandal of the happenings at the Assisi meetings (that you and Roger quite rightly mention) shocked and saddened many of the faithful – and with good reason. Yet, Pope JP II was an old and sick man by then, perhaps not fully conscience of some of his actions. At least I think we should see the “horrendous” happenings there in this light of understanding.

    Re the consecration of Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary – great point! I made a re-blog post some weeks ago about asking for this to be done, and got beaten over the head for it by some of our commenters! 😦

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  14. Roger says:

    Toad Our Lord in the Gospels spoke of wars and rumours of wars and the last times etc.. Because Man has a destiny which is a return to a lost and former state (the DOGMA OF ORIGINAL SIN).
    Your swipe at barely illiterate children is a very common argument and is as old as Man. Your argument is the same as the Jews 2000 years ago and their contempt for a Carpenter!!
    Lets see St Joan? did she or did she not rouse the Dauphin into kicking the English out of France?
    This is only one of many many examples.
    Pius XII did listen to illiterate children and he was an Authoritarian.
    There are Popes in Hell because as a Man that Pope is judged on His Sins.
    Personally I think it is madness to pursue this canonisation because of persistent rumours at the personal level. The Church proceeds slowly and humbly. The Devils Advocate is the greatest friend to the Faith!
    Think if persistent rumours turn out to be founded then the whole integrity of the Church collapses.
    What is impetus here behind this rush? Popular acclaim? or a PR stunt? Better to be a devil’s Advocate to safeguard the Faith than a yes man.
    Father Malachy Martin pointed out that John Paul II deliberately placed himself in places where as a Catholic he should not have been. Father Martin pointed out the dangers of deliberately exposing ourselves to satanic possession. Sic removing the Crucifx.
    John XXIII and his open doors is exactly the same danger. Here satan come in! and Paul VI said that the smoke of Satan had eneterd the Church! There is never smoke without Fire! God’s Will or Man’s Will? That is the question here.

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  15. Toadspittle says:

    “Lets see St Joan? did she or did she not rouse the Dauphin into kicking the English out of France?”
    Oui, she did, Roger. Now I get it – you’re French. Explains a lot.
    And Joan did it with a fine big sword personally sent down from Heaven to her from God, the great Anglophobe himself.
    …Thus setting the scene down the road for the glorious French Revolution, Le Can Can, Beaujolais Nouveau, and the works of J.P.Sartre.
    Maybe He also helped consecrated Russia kick out the Germans in 1943, as he seems to have a taste for intervening in national conflicts? I’d never considered that before.

    But back to Fatima. If Mary, in 1917, knew there was definitely going to be a second world war, why did she bother warning that it might happen if her exhortations were not heeded?
    ” Lucia quoted the Blessed Mother as saying: “The war is going to end.. if people do not cease offending God, a worse (war) will break out during the reign of Pius XI.” “

    Didn’t she know people would go on offending God?
    If not, why not?
    (But I’ve probably got this all wrong.)

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  16. Roger says:

    No Toad man has Free Will.
    WW I the principal combatants were the leading masonic nations.
    St Malachy’s Religio Depopulata (1914-1922) discovered in 16th century couldn’t be more accurate. But there is much more to Fatima than prophecy.
    The prophecy reference WW II remember was made to an illiterate. Now consider Pius XI died in 10th February 1939? So what war are we talking about? I suggest the Spainish Civil War which cannot be separated from WW II. That War ended with the Sun On earth! Atom Bomb! That was the sign of Fatima the Sun On earth! The Atom Bomb was just that wasn’t it?
    The century is dominated by a Pope and a vision that of Leo XIII and the sifting of the Church and the rules of free Will? are that there is an equiliibrium between if you like temptation and good. Without this our free will would be worthless. So if Heaven raises the Bar with Fatima it follows that Temptation is permitted to increase. Your response is a blame of God again very common. But the Our Father expressly refers to Our response to ideas!!! Temptations. Self is our real enemy. taht self awareness of Adam and Eve after the Fall! Self and the failure to question the thoughts that in turn lead to action! The Sifting of the Church?? now look at the 20th century and think avbout what that means and might mean. Pius XII his visions have never been published Why? Pius XII was the last genuine Pope under Tridentine (Sardis is the Tridentine Church) .
    The doors were opened by John XXIII and in came the smoke of Satan. So to remove the crucifix with the smoke of Satan in the Church is presumptious if not greatest folly.

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  17. Toadspittle says:

    But, Roger, what has all that got to do with…Oh, never mind.

    “WW I the principal combatants were the leading masonic nations.”

    Amazing they found something to fight about then, really.
    Maybe it was about how high you needed to roll up your left trouser leg?
    I wouldn’t know, myself.

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  18. Roger says:

    What does it have to do with Pius XII? Thats obvious is it not after the experience of WW II and a Pope who was prepared to Consecrate the World to the Immaculate Heart Of Mary and believed in Fatima and would not have agreed that Vatican- Moscow Treaty. I would have thought it was obvious what the drift here was.
    Because John XXIII refused to obey Fatima! Not for Our time. John Paul II paid lip service BUT thats about it.
    Malachy Martin who had read the third secret of Fatima said in 1990’s within 20 years one will come with all the answers AC after a moment of crisis. The question is are we seeing this moment of crisis developing?
    So we are back to the observation that to promote the cause of Pius XII is to promote a Pope who obeyed Heaven against two who as I say paid lip service BUT in reality were lukewarm. Also as I say there are personal rumours. Indecent haste? or PR?

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  19. Toadspittle says:

    “WW I the principal combatants were the leading masonic nations.”

    Do you think Roger, that the fact that Russia, France, Britain, Italy, Germany and Austria were also all considered “Christian” has anything remotely to do with it?
    “Gott Mitt Uns.” on the belt buckles, etc.?
    God was presumably anti-German in this case, because they lost.

    “There are Popes in Hell because as a Man that Pope is judged on His Sins.”
    Then you know something nobody else in the world knows. How do you know it?
    …apart from Father Malachy, of course. He knew. Pity he was never pope.

    “Also as I say there are personal rumours. Indecent haste? or PR?”
    Indecent haste? What about Escriva? How indecent can you get?

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  20. Roger says:

    Britain Mother country of Masonry and where the Empire went the Lodges were established. France and Germany the Grand Orient. Italy who imprisioned the Pope in the jail called the Vatican. On 24 January 1731, when the Grand Lodge of England appointed a Captain John Phillips as Provincial Grand Master of Russia and Germany. Russia and Masonry since 18th century. Austria well Mozart evidences this. By the way “..After the first world war Freemasons in Austria were accused of causing it! ..”
    If Masonry had been excommunicated why do you consider “christian ” as appropriate? Who equates winning with God? What lesson does the Passion teach Us?
    Popes in Hell? well Dante placed some there did he not?
    Why side track to Escriva? I suppose you know of the work of Father Villa and his personally papal approval to study Ecclesiastical Masonry? The story of him and St Pio is well known.

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  21. Toadspittle says:

    “Popes in Hell? well Dante placed some there did he not?”
    How did he know, Roger, Mon Ami?
    Anyway, Dante was a writer.
    He placed the popes there for a bit of light relief, in my opinion.

    “Who equates winning with God?”
    Lots of people. Henry V, for one, and Kathleen, regarding the Battle of Lepanto.
    Oh, and The Dear Old Generalissimo, of course: “I am responsible only to God and history.” (…and he wrote the history.)

    “Why side track to Escriva? “
    …He’s a fast-track, not a side-track. And here’s his theme tune:

    Hmmm…maybe they were right to canonise him.

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  22. Roger says:

    Saints not all were canonised. Canonisation as a formal Act was very late addition in the Church. So to the understanding of Eternal Damnation. Dante is simply recognising this! the knowledge of those sanctified and those damned. of course is a charism known to the pure of heart.
    This lack of discernment in Our Day is a reflection of the spiritual darkness of this Time.
    At the worldly level and in the eyes of the world winning is All. But then there is the knowledge of the Saints which is the folly of the Passion.
    Today it is the folly of the Passion which is being denigrated. The emphasis on the physical poor rather than spiritual is a sign of this spiritual blindness. So the exterior or physical becomes the basis for judgement, however where is the evidence of heroic virue?

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  23. Roger says:

    John Paul I
    “John Paul I had met Lúcia Santos while he was Patriarch of Venice, and was deeply moved by the experience. In a letter to a colleague after his election, he vowed to perform the Consecration of Russia which Lúcia said Mary had asked for”

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  24. Roger says:

    The Masonic Temple built around St Padre Pio is replete with symbols. Masonry is replete with symbols is it not? The crucifix bowed back towards the Earth instead of being elevated to Heaven. This contradicts Scripture. It also contradicts the Eucharist elevation of the Holy Sacrifice Of The Mass. I think its important to see the three Crosses on Calvary and question what this represented most likely the Bad thief!

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  25. Roger says:

    Not perhaps popular but lets consider Paul VI 1972, on the feast of Sts. Peter and Paul, Pope Paul VI. “From some fissure the smoke of Satan has entered the temple of God.” The tract that comes to mind is Apoc 9 1-3. The Association with St Peter and keys is particularly pertinent an consciously or unconsciously lends weight to Paul VI observation.

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  26. ginnyfree says:

    As far as I’m concerned, he already is a Saint! It will be nice when it becomes official. God bless. Ginnyfree.

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