The simple answer is “no“. It never has and it never will because these evils go in direct contrast to the teaching of Our Blessed Saviour Jesus Christ. His Bride, the Church, where the “gates of Hell will not prevail” cannot change her Divine mandate. Any Church (like some of the Protestant denominations) that refuses to call sexual acts outside marriage, between one man and one woman, sinful, is no longer part of the One True Church.
But this is where the Catholic Chuch has always welcomed fornicators, adulterers, active homosexuals…. and all sinners who repent of their disordered lifestyles and wish to beg God’s mercy and forgiveness. In this little box, down there….
“Go, and now sin no more” (John 8:11)
Edit: Those of us who recognise the gravity of sins that have separated us from God and repent of them, are automatically welcomed back lovingly into the ‘Fold’ of the Church. It would be wrong and a hypocrisy to ‘welcome‘ sin and try to justify the unjustifiable.
Catholicism Pure & Simple 
Kathleen : with respect to your opening Comments…I feel a distinction needs to be made between the One Holy Catholic Church and the Apostate catholic church.
The Gate of Hell will never prevail against the True Catholic Church but He will prevail against the other one/ So I ask the question, What of the overwhelming number of ‘catholic’ that adhere to the rubbish that the Modernist/Liberal attempted to inflict upon us? Those many Bishops/Cardinals and priest that lead the ‘ flock’ astray. ( they, I contend are the apostate ‘church’ )
We should not sit back smugly ( I am not referring to you) and say everything is OK because the Gates of Hell will never prevail is a capitulation to an extent because then many, will not fight back against those recalcitrants/apostates that threaten our salvation. Many, many have been led astray already and many more will be in the future. The gates of Hell will indeed prevail against the ‘church’ to which they adhere.
I under stand, in a strict definition, one could argue they are not members of the Catholic Church. However is a practical sense and for all intents and purposes they are precisely that.
I agree with you whole heartedly and rest assured that the Gates of will never prevail against the Bride of Christ but have no such confidence in the ‘whore’ that seeks the usurp her.
In the past those that attempted ( and in fact did) to change doctrine, left the Church and joined the ranks of th apostate churches.
Sadly the enemies of the Church today, who seek also to change doctrine, remain within the Church. They present a far greater and insidious threat to the Church
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Why the “Gates” of Hell? How can a gate prevail against anything.
It just stands there, swinging to and fro.
Are the “Gates” of Hell to keep the virtuous out, or keep the wicked in? Or both?
Why not the Forces of Hell?
…Idle thoughts
(Daumier?)
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Toad: are writing this with a good bottle of Red?
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Not yet, Geoff.Only 10.50 a.m. as I write this.
The red must wait ’til after Mass at Noon.
When the Gates (well, the door, anyway) of El Bar Castillo will not prevail against me.
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Toad: Then I suggest the maybe you should… I can recommend a ‘good drop’ from our great Swan Valley here in West Aust.
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Australian wines are excellent, Geoff.They were my staple food in the States.
…Be unpatriotic to drink them here, though.
And we can’t have that. …So Toro it is.
Heck of a story; Chaos in the Church (good headline!) I’d write it myself, if I wasn’t so lazy.
I suppose it’s really all, “Inside Baseball,” though.
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The word Gates is found in the Old and New Testament. That is your starting point to understand what Gate means.
Matthew 7:13
Enter ye in at the narrow gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way that leadeth to destruction, and many there are who go in thereat.
So the Gates of Hell are wide , broad and lead to destruction and many go there!
The anathema on Adam and Eve was Death.
The Living are in Christ since he came to repair what Adam and Eve had lost.
As Our Lord pointed out a man can be alive BUT spiritually Dead. Dead but spiritually alive.
That is therefor the purpose of the Faith Spiritual LIFE. The Gates of Hell are Eternal spiritual Death (thats forever).
The Church is the mystical Body of Christ (living) and in a state of Grace since NO SIN can enter Heaven. It follows that not everbody who calls themself of Christ is part of His Church (perhaps in mortal sin?).
Therefor there is a distinction between the Mystical Body Of Christ (Sinless) and membership of the Church (militant and suffering?) . Christ can and did forgive Sins sic the Good Thief and whom is without Sin?
Lets get one thing straight. Hell exists and its eternal damnation (that is a Truth of the Faith) and was seen by the children at Fatima. The wages of Sin are death (that is of the soul eternal death)
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..And let’s get this straight, too – Roger – the universe is not about 7,000 years old, and only gibbering lunatics think it is.
“Hell exists … …and was seen by the children at Fatima.”
I strongly suspect you’ve never had children of your own, (I sincerely hope, not, anyway.) and have not been told by them what wonderful things they can “see.”
What they “saw,” was a child’s picture-book illustration of hell:
“We saw, as it were, a vast sea of fire. Plunged in this fire, we saw the demons and the souls [of the damned]. The latter were like transparent burning embers, all blackened or burnished bronze, having human forms. They were floating about in that conflagration, now raised into the air by the flames which issued from within themselves, together with great clouds of smoke. Now they fell back on every side like sparks in huge fires, without weight or equilibrium, amid shrieks and groans of pain and despair, which horrified us and made us tremble with fright (it must have been this sight which caused me to cry out, as people say they heard me). The demons were distinguished [from the souls of the damned] by their terrifying and repellent likeness to frightful and unknown animals, black and transparent like burning coals. “
No doubt identical to what they’d been taught by priests and nuns that hell looked like.
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Before ditching articles of Faith consider that your soul and spirit is eternal. Created outside of time.
The Virgin Birth which is unprecedented.
The Transfiguration which revealed Moses and Elias. Now wasn’t Moses supposedly dead? Elias was taken up in a chariot of Fire. Both alive and talking to Our Lord.Now this is a question of Faith where are Moses and Elias?
The Apostles Creed Creator Of Heaven and Earth of All things visible and invisible.
Consider what the children at Fatima saw in Hell because did they see Souls, Spirits or material Bodies in Hell?
In other words states of humanity that are outside of the body. Souls and spirits. For the materialist souls and spirits do not exist. Hence the materialist science is only concerned with material (body) because they do not recognise either souls nor spirits.
Did either Demons and or Angels evolve? Where is the scientific evidence for the evolution of Soul or spirit of Heaven and or Hell.
Hell and Heaven are not a product of priest and nuns. Actually Man and Men have always believed in these.
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Geoff @ 4:39
We are on the same wave-length! 😉
I agree there are many who call themselves “Catholic” whilst adhering to a Modernist mindset that denies much of Catholic teaching on Faith and Morals. This usually goes hand in glove where all sorts of abuses surround the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, so these parishes may well be part of that “Apostate church” you mention. It is nevertheless a tragedy that many poor souls, mostly victims of bad catechism and preaching, have got sucked up into the betrayal and are quite unaware of this. Those knowingly responsible for twisting the Deposit of Faith should be reminded of Our Lord’s strong words on spreading scandal to His “little ones”!
However, would you just take a look at the snowy heads and lack of men or young people in the “Apostate church”; common sense tells us these will one day disappear. And then turn and look at the rows of (mostly young) men and women, and the families with numerous children, in parishes and groups that adhere to traditional Catholicism and (at least in Europe and the US) that seek out priests who celebrate the sublime Mass of the Ages. They are thriving and growing, in spite of the remaining bishops of “the magic circle” trying their best to shut them up!
There are many many Catholics who after wandering like lost sheep in this craziness of the so-called “spirit of Vatican II” become dissatisfied and seek the Truth. Through God’s grace and prayer they find their way back (or to) the “One Holy Catholic Church”.
We should never lose hope, even though everything looks very bleak sometimes with so many enemies “within the gates”… and those outside. Yes, the Church is facing a time of trial and persecution. I truly believe there will be much to suffer in the coming years – we have all the signs – and we have been forewarned of this by Our Blessed Mother in all her Apparitions of the last two centuries. We must refuse to compromise with the times now, whilst we still have relative freedom, so we will be strong to face up to the fierce challenges and suffering coming our way. We must cling to the Rock of the One True Holy Catholic Church.
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“Where is the scientific evidence for the evolution of Soul or spirit of Heaven and or Hell.”
What utter nonsense is this, Roger? Of course, there is no evidence whatsoever.
Why isn’t there? Personally, I can think of several dozen reasons. So can anyone who is not a dolt.
You might just as well have asked;
“Where is the scientific evidence for the existence of Soul or spirit of Heaven and or Hell.”
…and you’d get exactly the same answer.
“Hell and Heaven are not a product of priest and nuns. Actually Man and Men have always believed in these.”
Whoever suggested that they were?
Did I? When?
Yes, Man and Men probably have always believed in them. Because Man and Men (and Woman and Women) are fundamentally ignorant and stupid, and have always believed in a great many untrue and foolish things.
For example, some people actually believe the universe is only 7,000 years old. You may laugh, but they really do.
Moreover, some people actually believe that when you go to Hell, devils with horns and tails – and horrid, grumpy, sneery, faces, laugh unkindly at you, and prod you in the backside with red hot pitchforks, for all eternity. (I think I’ve got that right.)
But I must say I cherish your inimitable contributions.
…We all do.
Good deeds shining in a naughty old world.
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What!? Three thumbs down (so far)! Does this mean we don’t all cherish Rogers inimitable comments?
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Toad, I hope you are enjoying your retirement from tabloid journalism.
You serve as living proof that tabloids are shallow and valueless, not even fit for wiping one’s…/-[That’s enough! Ed]
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I know it is a cliche to say it is always darkest just before dawn, but it is just so true.
As anyone who has met Jesus in their life knows, Divine Joy waits for us around every gloomy and desperate corner.
Ask Mary Magdalene.
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The Transfiguration cannot be contemplated enough.
Present are both Moses (author of the Torah which covers Creation plus Patriachs and their ages including Noe, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and Joseph ) and St John (author of a Gospel and Apoc).
There is Our Lord transfigured in their midst. What greater testament of creation could there be?
Creation and the timescales of Moses are entrenched in the Faith.
Evolution’s children are Marxism and National Socialism (Nazism) materialist Paradise.
The Faith has been diluted distilled and convoluted so that the exact opposite is now believed. Any defence of the Faith is ridiculed and denigraded. Our Lord came for poor sinners sadly the proud and upright in their blindness rejected Him. The same process is seen at the highest levels today.
Poor Sinners Yes BUT SINS NO!
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You forget Pope said Whom am I to judge?
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Thank you very kindly, Burro.
Yes, I’m enjoying my dotage hugely.
In fact, I retired from tabloid journalism about about thirty years ago.
But, it’s the thought that counts, as you more or less say.
…And regarding the use that you make of the tabloids – I would advise using something more forgiving on what is clearly the most sensitive part of your anatomy.
It’s well worth the extra expense.
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Feed my Lambs!! Popes MUST Judge! This is precisely what Popes Do.
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“Judge not – lest ye be judged.”
But that was said before long before CP&S was invented. Outdated now. Look at the judgemental comments addressed at “Bergoglio.” No honorific, even.
Here’s a thought re: Burro’s Darkest Hour, (which this hour is still very far from) derived from “Brave New World” – as long as there’s one Catholic alive still somewhere – then all is not lost, and the “Gates of Hell,” have not yet prevailed.
(Wonder what particularly provoked B’s playground and lavatorial shaft of wit* at Toad?)
*Spoonerism?
“Evolution’s children are Marxism and National Socialism (Nazism) materialist Paradise.” Everyone and everything is “evolution’s child,” Roger. Including politics, philosophy and religion, Marx, Hegel, Aquinas, and Pope Francis. And computers and cars. And dogs. And blogs.
…Everything. Look for yourself at how The Church itself has evolved – from 13 penniless, scruffy, unemployed, young men with no place to rest their heads – to the gilded. marble-columned, world-wide, mega-rich monster – where large numbers of “Princes of the Church,” clad in silk, lace and gold, live sumptuously in palaces attended by retinues of servant nuns – that we all love and revere today.
Maybe that is the problem, or at least part of it?
(Toad channels Savonarola!)
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Toad, are you doing your best to be numbered among those who I referred to above (^) as “the enemy within” the Church? (As a baptised Catholic you can hardly be numbered among “the enemy without” however much you laud your rampant Agnosticism!)
You have made lots of nasty insinuations towards the Catholic Church; I shall respond to one of them….
To your last one mocking “the Princes of the Church“, and that is a constant in your ongoing attacks on the robes of Cardinals, you mistakenly see this as a personal sign of vanity – wrong! The beautiful vestments worn by the clergy for the celebration of the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, or in public ceremonies of the Church, is for no other reason than to do honour to the SACRED PRIESTHOOD OF JESUS CHRIST that the Cardinal (or bishop, priest etc.) is robing themselves in as His representative. The minister, in his human unworthiness, puts on (as it were) the best that human hands has to offer “to make worthy” his person, chosen for this Sacred mission, or act.
Some of the our holiest and most humble members of the clergy that you enjoy disparaging, who most greatly honour and give glory to Our Lord Jesus Christ by the wearing of such beautiful vestments, are most evidently (by the witness of their personal lives) the holiest and most faithful priests of God. It is significant that the members of the clergy who think they do not need to robe themselves in such fine vestments symbolising their roles, might well be the most self-centred and proud!!!
Here’s a good example from Vox Cantoris:
“Remember this, Francis of Assisi was poor on the outside and with his own habit, but not for the Holy Mass and not for the doctrine of the Church. St. Pio had one habit but when he celebrated Mass, he wore a glorious chasuble of silk and gold thread and even a lace alb with his one, old poor habit, underneath. His clothes were poor but he dressed in fine linen, silk and gold because he was going up to the Altar of God to offer the Holy Sacrifice with silver and gold sacred vessels. That was for the LORD, not for him. Does anyone wish to question this Saint’s humility or poverty whilst on earth?”
http://voxcantor.blogspot.com.es/2014/09/the-lion-of-rome.html
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The Lords Prayer is worth mediating and studying. Man is this composite of soul , spirit spiritualized matter) and what we call material body. What and where do thoughts come from? What and where do inspirations come from? What are these Temptations?
What Faith tells me is that the unbaptised remain under Original Sin and therefor under Satans domain and influence. Satan wants to reverse the Passion and Ressurection , to return Man to His slavery under Original Sin (thats the Faith). Satan wants Divorce. Satan wants Abortion etc..
We have Free Will we can choose BUT this choice is only between two verities Hatred (negation of God) and Love (God is Love) . From this comes Hell (antithesis of Love therefor Hatred) and Heaven. The Faith cannot be changed (public revelation) it can be revealed in its wonders and depths.
As I point out the Transfiguration cannot be contemplated enough.
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“What Faith tells me is that the unbaptised remain under Original Sin and therefore under Satan’s domain and influence.”
…Do they go to Hell, then, to live under Satan’s domain – if they are never baptised, Roger?
You might well be right about all the flashy bling, and the pretty and lacy vestments worn by some men of the Church, Kathleen – And I do see what you are getting at, but I’m still somewhat dubious – the participants all seem to be revelling in it, at least to me.
I get the idea pope Francis agrees. Might well be wrong about that, too.
But, contrariwise, you might be wrong.
…It all boils down to a matter of opinion really. …Like virtually everything.
I don’t personally care for the look of all that magpie- attracting glitter. You do.
That’s all.
Anyway – neither of our opinions can be remotely proved.
That much we gladly agree.
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Beautiful vestments are works of art, and devout priests wear them for the glory of God. The fact that some clergy, smitten with pride, “make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments” is irrelevant to their intended purpose. Vestments, icons, sculpture, stained glass, lofty cathedral spires, etc. are of a piece, meant to instill a worshipful frame of mind, by offering a faint glimpse of the heavenly realm. Of course, there is also a place within Catholicism for a more visually ascetical approach to worship, including many monasteries and convents. Both ways are worthy of honour and respect.
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Opinion is human reasoning.
No different than Pilates question when faced with Truth!
The Faith is the public revelation of the Truth.
Consider the discussion fornicators, adulterers, sodomites? Well how about the West (Christendom’s) legalised murder of millions of babies (Abortion) unbaptised!!
Also Divorce and Birth Control! The sacrament of marriage exists for the pro creation of children!
We have a Society that is so opposed to God that it kills its children and prevents their Creation!
How very convenient to talk of Evolution its natural killing off the weak so that the strongest survive (pure Nazism).
The Faith has God the Creator of all things visible and invisible. Creation is a living and ongoing not something of the Past! Creation is ongoing! vibrant and alive. Evolution is DEAD entrenched in a disassociated past! The child the superior to its parents thats Evolution!
Here is Satans achievement defication of human reasoning and rejection of public revelation Christ ( Truth). Satan has made this generation believe what was promised to Adam and Eve, become like God!
Our Lord was silent before Herod! Consider this and what that meant! The worst thing that can happen to Man is to find Our Lord Silent! Nothing which can be said to save that soul!
The Truth is if you severe your links to Christ you will find the tyranny of Satan.
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How very convenient to talk of Evolution its natural killing off the weak so that the strongest survive (pure Nazism).”
Not really, Roger. The weak are not “killed’ – but, true, they sometimes fail to survive. But there is a great deal of difference in that. Neanderthal man, for one. Humans peobaly didn’t actually kill him – he just wasn’t as well suited to life as they were.
No, it’s not very nice, any of it. Life isn’t very nice. But it’s a fact and we must accept it, and deal with it.
As usual you are talking through your hat.
Read a bit of Dawkins the naturalist, (The Blind Watchmaker, for example.) not Dawkins the Atheist.
It will do you good. …And give your arguments a bit more substance.
Very well said, JH, at 14.57. I love a good cathedral ( Say, Burgos!) as warmly as anyone. All a matter of relative taste.
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Mein Kampf
“..By leaving the process of procreation unchecked and by submitting the individual to the hardest preparatory tests in life, Nature selects the best from an abundance of single elements and stamps them as fit to live and carry on the conservation of the species..”
I have read The Blind Watchmaker.
The Transfiguration has the God Man with the Author of Genesis and the Author of the Apocalypse. There is the explicit endorsement of Creation , Adam and Eve, the Fall. The Patriachs including Enoch etc.. Speaks volumes doesn’t it.
The Apostles Creed Creator of Heaven and Earth. This is the Faith.
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“..By leaving the process of procreation unchecked and by submitting the individual to the hardest preparatory tests in life, Nature selects the best from an abundance of single elements and stamps them as fit to live and carry on the conservation of the species..”
If that is Hitler quoted, he’s not far off the mark. The word we should question here is “best.” The “best,” do not necessarily survive, but “best” is such slippery and debatable concept. Hitler certainly killed a lot of people who were “better” than he was, in every respect. We’d all agree that.
Hitler would have been more accurate if he’d said, “Nature selects the most adaptable from an abundance of ….etc, etc.” Because it does. If polar bears can’t adapt to melting ice caps, they will die.
What did you think of The Blind Watchmaker, Roger?
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Toad Dr Crick (DNA spiral) who was an atheist! Understood that any catastrophe that destroyed Life would destroy the timescales required for Evolving. He postulated that Life came from outer space. Dawkins argument is one of perception of design, complex structures evolving and competing seem to be designed when random changes over eons could account for the resulting structure.
But then comes the numbers. If you have millions of animals/ creatures then a small change can have ramifications over long timespans. However what if the numbers a very small and sparsely distributed! In other words ever other birth is producing freakish changes. Now the BBC have a timely for the expotention growth of the human population and guess what within a few thousand years its sparse!
Animals? well any farmer knows that there is a equilibrium between the species such as can be supported by the available land. This includes especially the Apes!
Man is not subject to these constraints over the land required to sustain populations.
However I digress I see Our Lord 2000 years ago faced with a conflict between the human reasoning of that time and Truth. Truth was crucified. So today I am not suprised that the Faith (Truth) is challenged and denied, because the Fathers Of the Church believed that the Church would recreate the Life Of Christ!
I have come to believe that the triumph of the Fatima is a Ressurected Faith (nolonger imprisoned in the Vatican[Rome]) but that presupposes the Passion of Truth crucifed by human reasoning and the Passion was brought about by the High priests 2000 years ago!
So the Faith is the Truth else what was the purpose of the Passion? I go and stay with the Faith!
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OK, Roger.
“Toad Dr Crick (DNA spiral) who was an atheist!”
Well, yes.
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But…
“Understood that any catastrophe that destroyed Life would destroy the timescales required for Evolving.”
Why?
How?
….Why should an catastrophic earthquake, or a massive meteorite smash, destroy “timescales” (whatever they are)?
I take it you weren’t impressed by Dawkins’ Watchmaker?
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Dawkins is a evangelist Atheist haven’t you noticed! Obsessed with Atheism, Obsession is a traint of a soul that is not at peace.
The Watchmaker starts from simply building blocks into complex (that is Dawkins hypothesis).
But if the higher life forms are destroyed everything is knocked back to the begining. Thus a diasaster that destroys eons of genetic layered build ups means you are back to the begining. Cricks realised that you need the higher complex blocks avaliable at a later period! Hence his proposition that the material came from space.
It is clear that with flesh there are for instance common complex blocks that are commonly found if you like common solutions and architectures.
Consider a sparse population with random mutations (that is what Evolution is about mutations) its most likely that the mutant won’t survive and the dominant will. Evolution requires millenium of years (whatever the word year means where the Sun is twice its present size) .
Man is parent dependant for years and is all but naked (lack of hair). Apes are far better equiped to survive than a Man.
However the Bible does indicate metabolist changes sic death, original sin, life expectancy and this is seen as anathemas in the lives of the patriachs. The anathema most known is that of the Babel and the curse of tongues (Nations) . The importance of Our Lord is that what was lost is being restored that His Passion is taking Man (those off their own free will of course) back to the paradise state. Paradise wasn’t this world, this world is a place of exile. Enoch was taken up as was Elias. Both have not yet experienced physical death.
The sacraments have this purpose to restore Man to His Lost status, open Heaven. But its our free will choice off course. But enough a generation that kills its infants and destroys marriages and birth control is spiritually dead. In this lies the greatest danger for Mankind.
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An Irish Facebook contact has alerted me to this appalling article from the Irish Times below. As he says: “Sin is sin……mortal sin is mortal sin…..the sin of sodomy is a sin crying out to Heaven for vengeance. That’s de fide from the Church of all times…..”
“It will not be possible for the Catholic Church to use certain language concerning LGBT and divorced people following last weekend’s Synod, Archbishop of Dublin Diarmuid Martin has said…” (Please read on; it gets worse!)
http://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/religion-and-beliefs/diarmuid-martin-pope-wants-to-recognise-people-s-struggles-1.1974091
This is just truly infuriating, and confirms all our worst fears about the confusion coming out of that Synod on the Non-Family!
What is happening to the Catholic Church in Eire, a country that suffered so greatly for so many centuries to remain faithful to the One True Faith? Against tyrannical and oppressive measures to wipe out any vestige of Catholicism, the Irish people courageously refused to give in and kept the Catholic Faith pure and free from Protestant, liberal contamination. Are we now caving in to the Modernists and traitors in our midst? Our ancestors would never forgive us!
Much of the blame must be laid at the door of weak and spineless Church leaders. Once more I am reminded of what Our Lady told the visionaries at Garabandal in the sixties, before any of this distortion of Catholic teaching (thus leading of the faithful astray by some members of the clergy) was common knowledge.
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Kathleen: There were some among us that thought the whole matter had been set right by forthright comments by some ( it was thought to be a majority) of the Bishops at the Synod. That was not enough. The designs of satan may have been dulled temporally but they were not extinguished . He will rely on the stupidity of some in the Church and he may well win the fight, but he will not win the battle.
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That’s right Geoff. Once the false rumours got out that the Church was going to change her timeless Teachings (an impossibility of course) many looked no further for evidence, and the massive confusion has simply expanded abroad. The Kaspar crowd are still sticking to their Modernist ideas and hoping for more ‘luck’ next year!!
I know this may sound like exaggerated hysteria, but I honestly believe we are in for a siege of sorts against the whole of our Deposit of Faith – so closely guarded and protected by the Magisterium of the Catholic Church from time immemorial. As one commenter pointed out (I think it was Michael Kenny) the enemies were once attacking the Church from the outside; now many of them are within the walls. This is far far worse!
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The publication of a list of masons in the Vatican in the 60’s and Masonic double speak!,
Father Malachi Martin disclosed that Satan had been enthroned in the Vatican in the 60’s.
There is a schism in the heart of the Church. The starting point is to realise this.
Look at Leo XIII and St Michael Archangel and think of the War that broke out amongst the Angels!
The falling stars are the Apostate hiearchy!
The Faith is being forced out of the Church. We should tremble at what this means because Christ is being expelled.
No this is not exaggerated hysteria Kathleen. But be prepared for ridicule and hostility.
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