Should a Genocide Denier Country join the European Union?

Armenian genocide

Armenian genocide

Hello Friends of CP&S,

We have just signed the petition “Should a Genocide Denier Country join the European Union?” on CitizenGO.

It’s important. Will you sign it too? Here’s the link:

http://www.citizengo.org/en/pr/35649-should-genocide-denier-country-join-european-union?tc=ty&tcid=24906869 

Islamic fundamentalism has been on the increase in Turkey in recent years. It would be a great danger to allow them entry into the European Union.

Thank you.

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11 Responses to Should a Genocide Denier Country join the European Union?

  1. toadspittle says:

    What do we care?
    ….We’re out.
    (It says here.)

  2. On this petition it states: “And Germany knows whereof it speaks, as shown in the role of the young German officer, Rudolf Höss, who helped to ‘modernise’ the Ottoman armies during the Armenian Genocide, before, himself, becoming, a few years later, the commandant of Auschwitz during the Second World War.”

    I am in fact going to sign this petition but I cannot in honesty do so without pointing out that this is absolute and inexcusable nonsense. Yes, there are links between the Young Turks, the atrocities they committed, and the Germans. It was not by coincidence that the only (as far as I am aware) Ambassador to the Holy See present in Rome last year when Pope Francis attended the memorial Mass for the Armenian and other dead of Europe’s First Holocaust not to attend was that of Germany.

    But to seek to gain traction by linking Auschwitz and the fate of the Jews to the Armenian genocide in this way is, at best, stupid. Rudolf Höss was born on November 25, 1901. I quote from Wikipedia (to save time). His father having died while he was a boy: “at age 14 he was admitted to his father’s and grandfather’s old regiment, the German Army’s 21st Regiment of Dragoons. At age 15, he fought with the Ottoman Sixth Army at Baghdad, at Kut-el-Amara, and in Palestine. While stationed in Turkey, he rose to the rank of Feldwebel (sergeant) and at 17 he was the youngest non-commissioned officer in the army. Wounded three times and a victim of malaria, he was awarded the Gallipoli Star, the Iron Cross first and second class, and other decorations. Höss also briefly commanded a cavalry unit.”

    How can this be construed, other than dishonestly, as “help(ing) to ‘modernise’ the Ottoman armies during the Armenian Genocide”?

  3. toadspittle says:

    That is, to expand a bit – since we’ve now democratically opted out, why should anyone on earth take our views on Turkish entry even remotely seriously?
    …Any more than the views of, for example – The People’s Republic Of The Congo?
    Not our problem any more.

  4. toadspittle says:

    “How can this be construed, other than dishonestly, as “help(ing) to ‘modernise’ the Ottoman armies during the Armenian Genocide”?
    Very succinctly put, Hugh.
    I suggest the answer is, good, old-fashioned, Catholic, paranoid hysteria. Might be wrong, though.

    (Are “CitizenGO,” utterly nuts? Don’t they know we’ve already CitizenGONE?)

  5. toadspittle says:

    “During a graduation ceremony in Istanbul, the Turkish President, Mr Erdogan, felt entitled to insult the people of Europe, declaring that: “The European Union does not want us [Turkey] because the majority of its population is Muslim”.”
    Well, I’m a “person of Europe,” and that didn’t insult me one bit – I think it’s quite true. And, if we were still part of the EU, the fact that most Turks are Muslim would be a major factor in not allowing them in.
    But it’s all moot, now.
    …As we are out with the Muslim Turks.

  6. Tom Fisher says:

    Hello Friends of CP&S,

    We have just signed the petition “Should a Genocide Denier Country join the European Union?” on CitizenGO.

    It’s important. Will you sign it too?

    It is important. The Armenian Genocide is very important. And there are many reasons, social economic, political, for opposing Turkey joining the EU. And those reasons should be discussed. And many of them I agree with. But if I were ever to get the ghost of a feeling that official Turkish denials of the genocide are being used as a populist pretext for an opposition which is actually based on other issues, I’d be a bit put off.

  7. toadspittle says:

    I’ve hogged this post, so far, and I’m sorry
    …but in my opinion, Europe ends with Greece – and the horrible Middle East starts with Turkey. Unfortunately, it doesn’t end there, either, just gets worse.

  8. kathleen says:

    Hugh McLoughlin @ 13:39 yesterday

    Although other sources put Rudolf Höss’ year of birth as 1900, there is indeed still no way a boy of that age could have been in a position to “‘modernise’ the Ottoman armies during the Armenian Genocide”! Other German commanders might have filled that role, but clearly not this Nazi-in-the-making. It is a shame exaggerations or untruths of this sort are used to try to strengthen a point, when the evidence itself – that Turkey committed genocide against the Armenians but refuses to admit their culpability – is sufficient argument to blocking their entry into the EU (in the opinion of most people, that is).

  9. kathleen says:

    Toad,

    Apart from the fact that almost 80 million Muslim Turks having the possibility to roam freely around Europe if they gain entry into the EU will almost certainly affect the countries who are not members of the Union just as much, there is also the probability that this ‘petition’ is not directed solely to citizens of the UK. The UK and Ireland have received it in English, but I expect other European countries will have received it translated into their own languages.
    You are falling for the old joke from the weather news (and that JH reminded us of the other day): “The continent is cut off due to fog in the English channel”.😆

  10. GC says:

    @Toad :

    …but in my opinion, Europe ends with Greece – and the horrible Middle East starts with Turkey. Unfortunately, it doesn’t end there, either, just gets worse.

    But Cyprus is in the EU, and it’s just 50 miles off the coast of Syria and 70 miles “beyond” Turkey.

    Of course, kathleen, our Irish friends would mostly prefer an English copy of the petition, as might some of our Danish, Swedish (and Dutch?) friends.

  11. toadspittle says:

    We will give Cyprus a mulligan, to mollify GC. But I rest my case.
    “..there is also the probability that this ‘petition’ is not directed solely to citizens of the UK. “
    Why on earth should it be? What use is that? And we are now the least relevant country in the EU, anyway.
    “..almost 80 million Muslim Turks having the possibility to roam freely around Europe if they gain entry into the EU will almost certainly affect the countries who are not members of the Union just as much,” Very likely. But, in that case…Oh, never mind.

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