Pope Francis calls woman with sex-change operation a ‘man’ and calls partners ‘married’

francis-with-transgenderweb_810_500_55_s_c1From LifeSiteNews, 3rd October 2016:

Despite the Vatican’s assertion that a so-called sex-change surgery does not alter the sex of a person, Pope Francis has nevertheless chosen to refer to a woman who underwent a sex-change operation as a “man,” and also referred to her as having “married” another woman and admitted to receiving them in the Vatican last year.

As with most of his most controversial remarks, the statements came during an in-flight press scrum. On October 2, on his return flight from his papal visit to Georgia and Azerbaijan, the Pope referred to a woman who “felt like a man” but “was physically a young woman.” After a sex-change surgery in her twenties, Pope Francis said, “he got married.”

“He wrote me a letter saying that, for him, it would be a consolation to come [see me] with his wife,” the pope said. “I received them and they were very happy,” Pope Francis added. Clarifying his use of pronouns, the pope said, “He that was her but is he.” (translation by Josh McElwee, the NCR reporter who asked the question)

Pope Francis drew a distinction between his frequent condemnation of teaching ‘gender theory’ to young children in classrooms and welcoming, accompanying, and integrating a person who has “this tendency” and even has “a sex change.”

The meeting of the Pope with the woman with the sex-change surgery and her female partner took place in January 2015 and while it was widely reported in the media with photos, the Vatican refused comment. The woman, now called Diego Neria Lejarraga, said the pope had surprised her by calling her twice out of the blue in December 2014. Neria had written to Francis complaining of rejection from the local parish after she had undergone “gender reassignment.”

Neria said that it was Pope Francis who asked for the meeting, telling her that he would make the arrangement and call her back. Francis welcomed the two into his private suite at Domus Santa Marta to what she said was a “strictly private meeting.”

In her letter to the Pope, Neria had specifically noted that she felt excluded from the Church because of her decision, and that she was now “afraid” to receive Communion. She did not tell the media what the pope said on the matter, only mentioning that he embraced her. However, Pope Francis’ own recollection of the matter deals with Communion.

The Pope spoke of an old retired priest who welcomed Neria and a young new pastor who was harsh. “When the new pastor would see him, he would shout to him from the sidewalk: ‘You will go to Hell.'” Francis said. “But when he’d meet his old priest, he would say to him, ‘How long has it been since you’ve confessed? Come on, confess so you can take Communion.’” (translation by the US Bishops’ Catholic News Service)

In 2000, the Vatican’s Congregation for the Doctrine of Faith issued confidential guidance to bishops noting that ‘sex-change’ procedures do not alter a person’s gender. The document instructed bishops never to alter the sex listed in parish baptismal records and said Catholics who have undergone “sex-change” procedures are not eligible to marry because in the eyes of the Church they would be marrying someone of the same sex.
literal translation of the Pope’s full remarks and the question issued by Catholic News Agency follows:

Josh McElwee, National Catholic Reporter: Thank you, Holy Father. In that same speech yesterday in Georgia, you spoke, as in so many other countries about gender theory, saying that it is a great enemy and a threat against marriage. But, I would like to ask you, what would you say to someone who has struggled with their sexuality for years and feels that there is truly a problem of biology, that his aspect doesn’t correspond to what he or she feels is their sexual identity. You, as a pastor and minister, how would you accompany these people?

Pope Francis: First of all: in my life as a priest and bishop, even as Pope, I have accompanied people with homosexual tendencies, I have also met homosexual persons, accompanied them, brought them closer to the Lord, as an apostle, and I have never abandoned them. People must be accompanied as Jesus accompanies them, when a person who has this condition arrives before Jesus, Jesus surely doesn’t tell them ‘go away because you are homosexual.’ What I said is that wickedness which today is done in the indoctrination of gender theory…a French father told me that he was speaking with his children at the table, he and his wife were Catholics, ‘rosewater Catholics,’ but Catholics! And he asked his 10-year-old son: ‘What do you want to be when you grow up?’- ‘a girl.’ The father realized that at school they were teaching him gender theory, and this is against the natural things. One thing is that a person has this tendency, this condition and even changes their sex, but it’s another thing to teach this in line in schools in order to change the mentality. This is what I call ideological colonization. Last year I received a letter from a Spaniard who told me his story as a child, a young man, he was a girl, a girl who suffered so much because he felt he felt like a boy, but was physically a girl. He told his mother and the mom…(the girl) was around 22 years old said that she would like to do the surgical intervention and all of those things. And the mother said not to do it while she was still alive. She was elderly and she died soon after. She had the surgery and an employee of a ministry in the city of Spain went to the bishop, who accompanied (this person) a lot. Good bishop. I spent time accompanying this man. Then (the man) got married, he changed his civil identity, got married and wrote me a letter saying that for him it would be a consolation to come with his wife, he who was she, but him! I received them: they were happy and in the neighborhood where he lived there was an elderly priest in his 80s, an elderly pastor who left the parish and helped the sisters in the parish. And there was the new (priest). When the new one he would yell from the sidewalk: ‘you’ll go to hell!’ When he (CNA suggests this refers to the new priest but CNS and NCR suggest it refers to the woman) came across the old one, he would say: ‘How long has it been since you confessed? Come, come, let’s to so that I can confess you and you can receive communion.’ Understood? (emphasis LifeSite)

Life is life and things must be taken as they come. Sin is sin. And tendencies or hormonal imbalances have many problems and we must be careful not to say that everything is the same. Let’s go party. No, that no, but in every case I accept it, I accompany it, I study it, I discern it and I integrate it. This is what Jesus would do today! Please don’t say: ‘the Pope sanctifies transgenders.’ Please, eh! Because I see the covers of the papers. Is there any doubt as to what I said? I want to be clear! It’s moral problem. It’s a human problem and it must be resolved always can be with the mercy of God, with the truth like we spoke about in the case of marriage by reading all of Amoris Laetitia, but always with an open heart. And don’t forget that chapter Vézelay, it’s very beautiful, eh! Very beautiful.

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28 Responses to Pope Francis calls woman with sex-change operation a ‘man’ and calls partners ‘married’

  1. ginnyfree says:

    Another misstep for our poor Holy Father. This is old news though. It would be great if after the poor woman’s meeting with the Pope we’d found out she’d begun her reversion process which would have to include leaving behind her fantasy life as a surgically mutilated female dressing up as a man before she’d really be worthy to receive Communion. I’ve said this before and got pounced on by more than one Progressive Catholic for “judging” etc. But guess what folks? If you are living a lifestyle that is in direct opposition to the Gospel, then you aren’t properly disposed to receive the Eucharist and should refrain. I can only hope the Pope had the courage to tell this young woman and the gal accompanying her to their private audience the truth about that. It is the most loving thing their Pastor could do – tell them the truth about their sins and how to leave them behind before it is too late. God bless. Ginnyfree.

  2. JabbaPapa says:

    This is just PURE VANDALISM on the part of those “reporting” this latest anti-Pope mindless gibberish

    The Pope : “Today, in schools they are teaching this to children – to children! – that everyone can choose their gender,” he told bishops in August.
    Francis added that the increased visibility of trans people is due to “ideological colonising” – which he believes is “terrible”.

    The Pope : “You, Irina, mentioned a great enemy to marriage today: the theory of gender,” the pope said. “Today there is a world war to destroy marriage. Today there are ideological colonizations which destroy, not with weapons, but with ideas. Therefore, there is a need to defend ourselves from ideological colonizations.

    This is not the first time Francis spoke out about gender theory. In June of 2015, just as Bruce Jenner was transforming himself into “Caitlyn”, the pope condemned the idea of gender theory, calling it “an error of the human mind” and one that “does not recognize the order of creation.”

    He has also repeatedly bemoaned the concept of ideological colonization, which he describes as attempts by wealthy nations to link foreign aid to acceptance of radical social policies such as same-sex marriage and gender theory.

    During the same address in Georgia, Francis spoke of the pain experienced by children as a result of divorce.

    “You do not know, dear brothers and sisters, you do not know how much children suffer, the little ones, when they witness the arguments and the separation of parents! Everything should be done to save a marriage.”.

    For tone — just LOOK at the utterly disgusted expressions of the Pope when discussing these objective evils :

    http://www.independent.ie/videos/world-news/video-pope-slams-teaching-of-gender-theory-calls-being-transgendered-a-moral-problem-35099105.html

    To say that he is supporting them is MORONICALLY STUPID.

    Pope Francis : Pope Francis has condemned schools for teaching gender theory, calling being transgendered “a moral problem” that is “against the natural things”.

    —————

    Is this website going to STOP collaborating with these objective mortal sins of bearing false witness against our neighbour ?

    ————–

    PS — Pope Francis said, “he got married.”This is not possible, given that the Italian expression in question, “translated” (AHEM !!!) here, does NOT use a masculine pronoun.

    PUT AN END TO THIS UTTERLY GHASTLY STREAM OF ENDLESS LIES.

  3. johnhenrycn says:

    “Is there any doubt as to what I said? I want to be clear!”

    Yes, Holy Father, all Catholics want you to be clear. My first piece of advice is to quit speaking to people on plane flights about anything other than what’s on the lunch menu. Clearly the reduced oxygen flow in plane cabins is not conducive to clear thinking by a pope with only one functioning lung.

  4. JabbaPapa says:

    Clearly the reduced oxygen flow in plane cabins is not conducive to clear thinking

    What’s your excuse ?

  5. mmvc says:

    `To say that he is supporting them is MORONICALLY STUPID.`

    When you realise that nobody in this article is in fact saying that the pope is supporting ‘these objective evils’ you might not get quite so cross, Jabba. CP&S has re-posted articles about these in-flight papal press conferences from reliable sources such as LifeSiteNews whenever they occur. Please refrain from instructing us what to post or what not to post. You are free to skip any pieces you dislike here as you are to post whatever you like on your blog.

    As you rightly point out, not everything the pope says is ambiguous, troubling or confusing – though sadly some of it is. But why should faithful Catholics not be aware of some of his controversial utterances if only to be prepared to deal with having them thrown back at them by liberal minded folk? Or even in order to redouble their efforts to pray and fast for the Holy Father?

  6. johnhenrycn says:

    Jabby, I am totally gutted by that insult. I don’t see how I can possibly carry on fighting against a comic act as good as yours. I wish John Kehoe was allowed more generous access to this blog. At least he’s someone I never fail to get the better of.

  7. GC says:

    JabbaPapa @ October 3, 2016 at 17:44
    PS — Pope Francis said, “he got married.” — This is not possible, given that the Italian expression in question, “translated” (AHEM !!!) here, does NOT use a masculine pronoun.
    PUT AN END TO THIS UTTERLY GHASTLY STREAM OF ENDLESS LIES.

    From the Vatican’s transcript of the press conference:

    Poi si è sposato – ‘then he married’.

    ‘She married’ would be si è sposata.

    (Though it could mean ‘it married’ – all ‘its’ are either grammatically masculine or feminine in Italian, there is no neuter gender – but somehow I don’t think he meant ‘it’, do you?)

  8. ginnyfree says:

    I can’t resist GC, I think NEUTERED is the correct grammatical construct, for it surely meets with the actual surgical accomplishment most fightingly! These people are surely neutered in many ways beyond the mere anatomical. Rendered unfit for marriage to anyone actually.

    Homosexuality whether hidden or open is an impediment to Matrimony. More to think about. God bless. Ginnyfree

  9. GC says:

    Alas, ginny, I did resist when a similar thought occurred to me while scribbling as above^.

    I’m afraid the Bish of Rome may need to resort to another language for his 6-mile-high press club; to a language that does, in fact, have neuter grammatical gender if he wants to convey the idea of ‘it got married’. German might be the ticket, possibly. Or a language, perhaps, that has no grammatical gender at all, like Chinese or Indonesian/Malay?

  10. JabbaPapa says:

    Poi si è sposato – ‘then he married’.

    ‘She married’ would be si è sposata.

    (Though it could mean ‘it married’ – all ‘its’ are either grammatically masculine or feminine in Italian, there is no neuter gender – but somehow I don’t think he meant ‘it’, do you?)

    It’s a very weak foundation for yet another bit of Pope-battery.

    http://www.accademiadellacrusca.it/it/lingua-italiana/consulenza-linguistica/domande-risposte/accordo-participio-passato

    La possibilità di scelta per i punti 2, 3 e 4 è esistita da sempre in italiano e le restrizioni di tanto in tanto indicate da qualche grammatico sono da considerarsi infondate. Anche in uno scrittore particolarmente sensibile al problema dell’omogeneità linguistica come Alessandro Manzoni si possono cogliere alternative: “le cose che m’hanno fatto” (I Promessi Sposi, cap. XXXV) – “le ciarle che avrebbe fatte” (cap. III), – [gli uomini] “si riunivano in crocchi, senza essersi dati l’intesa” (cap. XII) – “altri passeggeri s’eran fatta una strada ne’ campi” (cap. XI) ecc.»

    But the worst one could really “accuse” the Pope of here, realistically that is, is to have made an extremely common mistake in concordance that virtually all Italians will make from time to time.

    If he had used “egli” or “lui” or referred to this surgically altered woman as a “uomo” there might be something here, but he didn’t, did he.

  11. GC says:

    A good old (Italian) Apulian grandpa in the 70s, with only a modicum of schooling and when telling me of all his granddaughters, was quite able to say with some obvious contentment which of them was ‘sposata‘.

    I think you will find in the transcript that the Bish called the person involved a ‘lui’, not an ‘esso’ (edit: and also a ‘uomo’). Of course too, in Italian we sort of know mostly if it’s a she or a he from the endings of nouns, adjectives and participles.

  12. JabbaPapa says:

    The Pope’s Italian isn’t is also divergent from standard Italian : http://www.agora24.it/2016/06/papa-francesco-la-lingua-italiana/

    He speaks in a fairly familiar style, influenced by Piemonte dialect as well as Spanish, and no he is not considered to have Italian as his mother tongue.

    To base one more severely exaggerated accusation against him on the basis of one letter in one word used in spoken language (where such minor errors are BTW completely tolerated) and as a non-native speaker is clearly ludicrous.

  13. GC says:

    Enough said.

  14. JabbaPapa says:

    Yeah, just checked in a Piemontese Grammar text, and the past participle is invariable in that dialect — it’s just a dialectalism, NOT any of the other rubbish.

  15. GC says:

    jabba, give up. (Why am I even doing this?). If you check the Roman bish’s participles in the rest of the ‘presser’, they are spot on.

  16. JabbaPapa says:

    Well, it’s somewhat more complicated looking further into it (depends which verb group), but past participles are always invariable when used in conjunction with a pronoun in Piemontese.

    Dialectalism.

  17. JabbaPapa says:

    (Why am I even doing this?)

    Not adding any more, if that helps.

  18. GC says:

    Give it up, jabba.

  19. johnhenrycn says:

    GC says(17:26) – “jabba, give up. (Why am I even doing this?).”

    Jabs has made his point that he’s mastered every important European language, except Finnish. Is there not a Language Blog where he could post all his boring insights on? I do indeed like Jabby, but he’s getting to be a bore. Did I say that already?

  20. JabbaPapa says:

    Jabs has made his point that he’s mastered every important European language, except Finnish.

    En ole.

  21. johnhenrycn says:

    I only know two Finnish words, and those aren’t them. My Finnish surname means “woodpecker”; but it’s also a type of Punjabi cuisine. Not Melungeon.

  22. ginnyfree says:

    Google translate tells all!

  23. geoffkiernan says:

    Just waiting for the usual suspect to have the last word…….

  24. johnhenrycn says:

    I’m filling in for Jabba tonight, Geoff. What is it you were going to say?

  25. mmvc says:

    The Pope’s confusing statement on gender theory: a follow-up

    By Phil Lawler

    Several readers have written to me overnight, saying that I was mistaken in saying that Pope Francis had sent mixed messages about gender theory. Let me respond to that concern.

    When he spoke in Tbilisi, Georgia, the Pope was admirably clear in his denunciation of gender theory. (I said that much in my piece yesterday.) When he was pressed on the issue during his in-flight press conference, with a question from a National Catholic Reporter correspondent, he was not clear at all.

    Let’s review what the Pope said in that exchange with reporters that, in the view of some readers, showed his opposition to gender ideology*:

    He mentioned a French man who objected when his 10-year-old son was taught gender theory in school. Then he said: “It is one thing that a person has this tendency, this option; and even those who change sex. It is another thing to teach along this line in schools, to change the mentality.” Thus he implied—perhaps unintentionally—that his objection was to teaching gender ideology, not necessarily to sex-change procedures.
    “Sin is sin,” the Pope said. “Tendencies or hormonal imbalances cause many problems…” Later he added: “It is a moral question. It is a problem.” Yes, but what is the nature of that problem: a hormonal imbalance, an emotional illness, or a mistaken gender assignment? What is the solution: conversion, counseling, or surgery?
    “I wish to be clear,” the Pope said. In the more complete transcript furnished by CNA, he elaborated: “Please don’t say, ‘The Pope sanctifies transgenders.’” (Curiously that line was omitted from the official Vatican summary.) Unfortunately, wishing to be clear does not guarantee clarity. Surely the Holy Father did not set up transgender people as models. And we can all agree that the Pope does not endorse sex-change operations. But if a confused young person read through the Pope’s answer, looking for some reason not to change his sexual identity, he would not find it.
    Yet this lack of clarity is not, in my view, the major problem with the Pope’s answer. My greater concern was his willingness to accept his Spanish visitor’s self-identification as a male. Right now, in the field of gender theory—which the Pope, in Tbilisi, rightly identified as a war on marriage—the main battleground is over the use of pronouns. The gender theorists insist that if a man identifies as a woman, or a woman as a man, we must use the pronouns those individuals prefer, rather than the pronouns that match objective reality. On that critical issue, the Pope yielded.

    There are some unfortunate people who suffer from anorexia, and persist in thinking that they must lose weight even when they are dangerously undernourished. These people need our help, our support, our love. But they do not need us to reaffirm them in the mistaken perception that they are fat. They might harm themselves by continuing to diet; if we really love them we should try to correct their self-image, to usher them back to reality. So too with people who suffer from other warped perceptions of reality, including men who think they are women and women who think they are men.

    During his press conference Pope Francis said that the problem of sexual identity “must be resolved as is possible, always with God’s mercy, with the truth, as we have said in the case of marriage.” [Emphasis added.] Telling the truth about sexual identity is the only effective way to counter the propaganda of the gender theorists.

    * Except in the one case indicated above, I have taken quotations from the “summary” of the press conference produced by the Vatican press office, rather than from the full transcript, since the official summary presumably is a better indication of what the Pope intended.

  26. JabbaPapa says:

    In the more complete transcript furnished by CNA, he elaborated: “Please don’t say, ‘The Pope sanctifies transgenders.’” (Curiously that line was omitted from the official Vatican summary.)

    http://press.vatican.va/content/salastampa/it/bollettino/pubblico/2016/10/03/0702/01568.html

    Per favore, non dite: “Il Papa santificherà i trans!”. Per favore! Perché io vedo già i titoli dei giornali… No, no.

    —-

    Thus he implied—perhaps unintentionally—that his objection was to teaching gender ideology, not necessarily to sex-change procedures.

    This is incredibly shoddy “thinking” — he just desires to push this narrative by any means available, and if he needs to gratuitously add contents that are not present in the text, then wey-hey-hey, allons-y !!!

    Pathetic.

    Yes, but what is the nature of that problem

    This man really should learn how to read properly : E questo è contro le cose naturali. — that’s the “nature” of the problem for him, it’s that it’s contrary to the Natural Order.

    oooooh, but that’s not good enough eh, ‘cos it doesn’t “fit” with the anti-Francis narrative he’s constructing …

    But if a confused young person read through the Pope’s answer, looking for some reason not to change his sexual identity, he would not find it.

    Yes well, one can’t deny that this man is an expert in mental confusion, given his own …

    My greater concern was his willingness to accept his Spanish visitor’s self-identification as a male

    This person clearly has no understanding of the Pope’s sarcastic characterisations : lui, che era lei, ma è lui. — the Pope clearly points out that this “he” is in fact no sort of “he” whatsoever, but “she”.

    the official Vatican summary

    If he read it in English, then it’s NOT “official”.

    http://w2.vatican.va/content/francesco/en/travels/2016/outside/documents/papa-francesco-georgia-azerbaijan-2016.html

    Official transcripts of the Press Conference exist in Italian and Portuguese only.

  27. JabbaPapa says:

    since the official summary presumably is a better indication of what the Pope intended

    This is egregiously unlikely to be true — just consider the gross distortions by Fr Rosica in the Press Conference room during the two sessions of the Synod for the Family ?

    Non-stop pushing of a pro-gay pro-Adultery agenda, that was completely divorced from what the Synod Fathers were actually discussing.

    And he still thinks that the English language Press Office can be trusted an inch further than it can be thrown ? To provide “a better indication of what the Pope intended” ???

    Don’t make me laugh, that part of the Press Office has clearly been overrun by gay lobby members and “liberal”-“progressive” de facto protestants.

  28. JabbaPapa says:

    http://www.catholicherald.co.uk/news/2016/10/05/cardinal-sarah-lets-end-the-hateful-divisions-and-public-humiliation-over-liturgy/

    Cardinal Robert Sarah has said the “hateful divisions” over liturgy must end, and that liturgical debates have become an occasion for “public humiliation”.

    In an interview with the French publication Le Nef, translated by Catholic World Report, the cardinal, who heads the Vatican’s liturgy department, reportedly said: “Without a contemplative spirit, the liturgy will remain an occasion for hateful divisions and ideological clashes, for the public humiliation of the weak by those who claim to hold some authority, whereas it ought to be the place of our unity and our communion in the Lord. Why should we confront and detest each other?

    The cardinal also said fierce debates over the liturgy are the work of the devil: “Yes, the devil wants us to be opposed to each other at the very heart of the sacrament of unity and fraternal communion. It is time for this mistrust, contempt and suspicion to cease.

    He said he specifically regrets that ad orientem worship has been contested in an “ideological clash of factions”.

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